Charlie Kirk’s Death: A Catholic Priest’s Urgent Warning (Fr Cristino)

Charlie Kirk’s shocking death has left many Catholics asking deeper questions. In this conversation, Fr. Cristino shares his first reaction, the cultural dangers behind this tragedy, and why the Catholic faith is the only true antidote to the rising division and violence in our world.

Was Charlie Kirk on the path toward the Catholic Church before his death? What do his final words about the Blessed Virgin Mary reveal? And what warning should Catholics take seriously in these troubled times?

Transcript

Father Christina, welcome back. Thank you, Ken. You know, since we've last met, the world has been shocked by the murder of Charlie Kirk. Uh, I know that I found this very shocking, Janelle, as well. Uh, I did a video on it last week. Uh, it's seems timely that you have come into the studio now. I I wanted to ask you your first reaction. What was happening in your life when you heard that? And how what did you think? Uh, it's strange. I I hadn't heard yet. Uh and someone private messaged me a video clip saying uh one of the last things Charlie Kirk said was that evangelicals need to have greater devotion to the Blessed Virgin Mary. And when I saw that, I'm ashamed to say that my reaction was to kind of roll my eyes and say, "Well, isn't that nice, Charlie, but why don't you just become Catholic?" I I kind of had this cold reaction to it and I didn't think much of it and then I opened up my news and saw there was like the headline and it had just been announced that he had died. Wow. And so then I then I understood the context of why that person sent that to me and it really really startled me that it happened where it did that it actually happened at all. I just thought what an what a terrible sign of of how bad things have gotten in our inability to have civil discourse. Uh because I was immediately confident that this was a political assassination, that his views were no longer considered tolerable and someone decided that he needed to die. And it might not have just been someone either. Who knows? So I think my instinct was to process what this means culturally more than what this this meant about him. And then that's when it really struck me later when I when I later realized that uh his wife had to be informed afterwards. She wasn't there with him. I'm glad she didn't see it, but what this meant as in person, this man, his life was just extinguished. Uh, and I I'm very by accident. I was shocked to stumble upon the footage of of it actually occurring. I didn't realize that's what I was about to see. And so it really really disturbed me to watch that happen before my eyes uh and know that it happened in front of however many students were there. Uh and so it just left me very shaken and very sad for him and his family and for the world. Mhm. Um, we've had the funeral since or the memorial that they had yesterday. Um, and I think you were sharing with me you really didn't see much about it. No, I I couldn't. Uh, I was preparing to to come here to see you and so I I caught little snippets. Uh, I I heard the tail end of someone who was speaking that I don't know who he was, but I can't say I was a big fan of what I was hearing come out of him. Uh, and I heard uh Tucker Carlson uh speak uh the full length of of his uh of his speech. I couldn't quite make out what what it was, what the whole event was. It it didn't strike me that it was a a funeral, per se. Um, and some of the different snippets that I heard just sounded like a lot of political jargon and almost like campaigning. I was kind of put off actually. I just wondered we should be praying for this man. We should be memorializing the good that he's done. Uh, and we should be providing an outlet for people to grieve. Mhm. Uh, and I think that's tragically I I it sounds like he was on his way to the Catholic faith. There's multiple reasons to suggest that, including the fact that he had been seen routinely attending mass in their nearby parish. uh had he died a Catholic and had a Catholic funeral, uh the world would have seen how the Catholic faith ritualizes death and grief uh and really provides a powerful outlet to let people mourn as well as to honor and and remember. Uh I think we don't know really how to do that outside of having some kind of religious expression. Every culture has some kind of religious expression of that. And if you don't have a religious expression of it, you just talk about it. And I think that that's what constituted a lot of what they did for him. I know. I saw uh Bishop Baron was in attendance there and it seemed from posts from Word on Fire. It seemed like there was some contact with him and Charlie and um maybe a a potential future sit down. Um which I found interesting and it was too bad that that didn't happen. M um as you reflect upon this now and look at the broader implications of this, what are your thoughts on where we're at as a society? And

I don't know how to how to summarize it. His death strikes me as more than than a wake-up call. I I I think tragically it's uh it's the logical conclusion of where we've clearly been heading. The inability and or unwillingness to give each other the space to speak and to listen. uh the the knives are out as it were from the minute people who know they disagree with each other get into each other's presence. Uh and before we assassinate people by actually ending their lives, we've routinely gotten into the habit of assassinating people's characters. Uh, and that's I think what is deeply disturbing when people who have gone on at length to talk about how much they detest someone like Charlie Kirk will then, you know, take to Twitter or X or whatever it's called the next day and say thoughts and prayers to Charlie Kirk and his family. So, well, did you think about praying for Charlie Kirk before he was assassinated? uh do we do we think about each other? Do we make space to listen to each other? Uh, and and I have to say, and I don't say this to be critical of the work that Charlie Kirk did, but just as an observation, a lot of people call what he was doing a civil discourse,

but I'm not sure that that's how I would characterize how he did his work, especially on university campuses with students. Uh, it wasn't it didn't always look very civil to me. And now maybe that's because they only put out the content uh that you see on camera. I never saw anything live where people are fighting and where people are getting heated because that's more attractive to watch if you're just consuming media. Mhm. But if if that was how things were, shouting, name calling, uh applauding at other people's humiliations, that's not that's not civil discourse. And I I think that that this has happened is a sign to us that this will continue to happen to who knows who next if we don't wake up and realize that we have to be able to listen to each other. And listening implies trying to process what I'm hearing you say or asking follow-up questions. That's something I think I I I witnessed in in Charlie Kirk was he'd ask people, "What do you mean by that?" Or, "How do you how did you get to that definition?" He asked follow-up questions, which is brilliant and so important if we are going to have helpful conversation. But I think all too often listening is actually for many people waiting for you to stop talking so that I can already tell you why you're wrong.

There's a lack of humility in that that produces this this kind of animosity. faments this rage between people that just seems totally disproportionate to whatever is the thing that we're talking about the economy or jobs or foreign entanglements in government. H how are we how are we getting so outraged over topics that we happen to disagree over? And so there's a bigger question that I hope we start asking ourselves because all we are really doing is feeding the categorization of who's to blame for what. And when we just try and put people into camps and categories, that's what facilitates the impression that you're constantly at battle with whoever your enemy is. And saying, "I'm on the right side," is a pretty big claim to make. The sign that you're on the right side is that you're not on a side. That we are on the side of truth. And truth isn't an idea. Truth isn't a political theory. Truth is a person. Truth is Jesus Christ. So I must be one with him. And if I'm one with him, then there aren't sides for me to take and there aren't enemies for me to identify. There are only people to love and some will be much harder to love than others. Do you is that one of your biggest concerns going forward from this is that people's response is this is a sides that was the problem and I'm on this side. Um, I know that you saw my previous video on that and you had a a thought on um, what would you put it? A a miss or like a an area that you felt like I could have done a better job with. Well, I I guess how I would put it is there was at the end of your of your video where you were commenting on this and I and I resonated with the way you were expressing how you felt about the situation. But the thing I keep hearing come up over and over as people react to this is we clearly have a problem with the people on the left and this was leftists and this was the work of uh violent antifa whatever were were always looking for the other they are saying the exact same things about I don't know if I can even say us, but everyone's saying this about each other. You're a one of them, and that's the problem. The problem is sin. The problem is evil. And it can affect anyone at any given time, no matter what side of anything you're on. Mhm. And so to identify a side with evil is at best a misunderstanding, but at worst it's what facilitates and fosters the impression that you are so grave a problem you need to be dealt with. And that's clearly what someone or some people thought about Charlie Kirk and then that's what happened. Mhm. And case in point, Charlie Kirk has spent his career defending governments like the American government or the Israeli government who specialize in assassinating people. This is not the only assassination that's happened this year. These these are governments that say that they have the right to enter foreign territories and eliminate people because they are a perceived threat to me. I've decided that so we're taking you out. Mhm. Is it any surprise that eventually the bullets come back the other direction when that's what what we've done is decide I will decide that you are a person who needs to die. That's that escalation is inevitable when we put each other into categories and then refuse to listen to each other. So I'm not saying that Charlie Kirk had what was coming to him. What I'm saying is that's what we are breeding in a civilization that is so univilized. So your concern is like this this left right distinction of like I'm on this side then the other side is the problem where you're saying and then the other side is saying the very same thing back and saying look this just escalates things and is not necessarily even true right which is where you kindly offered a word of like consider this right so I I gave that some thought and I I I believe you're right you know after cuz I did at the end of my video and my frustration was like leaning towards labeling one side. But you said something in our private conversation that you haven't said here and and that is it's not the solution isn't going to one side. You said in our private conversation the Catholic Church is the universal antidote. Can you unpack that a little bit regarding that statement for this situation? Well, I I'll even go so far as to say that I think it seems like I I I feel reasonably confident that Charlie was also figuring that out. Catholic means universal. That means that the Catholic faith transcends all distinctions and fills every division. That is her unique charism by virtue of being Catholic universal. She can go to everyone everywhere with the gospel of Jesus Christ who is truth. Wherever there is evil, whatever side it's on, the only antidote is that whatever is causing that to happen be touched by the presence of the sacramental grace that the church singularly brings and her teaching. Because people who get themselves into a side almost always are on a side because they have a cause, something that they perceive in the world that is wrong and needs to be fixed or is unjust and needs to be stabilized. Everyone will have one of those. Only the Catholic Church will be able to go to anyone side with a solution. And that's part of what I think frustrates people about Catholicism. You know, you guys claim to have the answer for everything. Yes, we do. And that's not because of something special about me as one Catholic priest in this institution or because of the historical power that the Catholic Church has amassed over 2,000 years. It's because of who made her, who shed his blood for her. He has endowed her with that. And so the answer is not winning a debate. The answer is proposing as as effectively and attractively as possible to you on this side on this topic. What is the truth that the Catholic Church has to say about that thing? Because we will have something to say about that. And if people would realize that that's what's missing, we'd have a lot less to debate about and the and the and the labeling would have no purpose. Mhm. All there would be are happy faithfully practicing Catholics and not. And now right away people will say, "So what are you saying that everyone should just be Catholic?" Yes, I am saying that. But not I'm not saying it in a in a glide way where I feel like as long as the waters of baptism just got sprayed over the heads of 7 billion other people in the world that all our problems would go away. All our problems would just get imported into the church. But where there is division and disagreement, the church has an answer. But we have to come to that with the use of our reason and decide this is true. I think I think that's what's happening to Charlie Kirk. So I just want to say on a on a you know I want to say I think your your response was better than the ending of my video. Okay. So I I I thank you for the gentle correction. I appreciate it cuz I didn't know what what I did after our conversation was because my tendency is like you know when something goes wrong my tendency and this is a weakness who did it in our family which kid spilt this water it was me you know and so like okay who's to blame and I think that's a a normal reaction to our fallen nature because we want justice right so who's the one so you know I see a lot of turning towards the political left. It's like you're the problem right now. That's a that's a big scream right now. Um, which after our conversation I'm like, well, is it true? So, I actually started doing some digging and I looked at some research and I realized I I really couldn't find anything to say either side was more responsible for violence on the right or on the left. Mhm. And um in fact, interestingly, um I brought up Bishop Baron earlier cuz he was in attendance at the at the memorial. Uh he in an article right after Charlie Kirk was murdered did mention in an interview that 34% of university students surveyed found that it was acceptable to have to commit violence against a speaker when you disagreed with them. 34%. Wow. Which and then if you do a deep deeper dive into the statistics and I did find the original source of that which was the college of free speech rankings is an annual report created by the foundation for individual rights and expression. Their annual college free speech ranking survey in 2020. The national average showed about one in five students said it was ever acceptable to use violence to stop a speaker. That number has since risen to a disturbing one in three students. They did categorize it between political leanings and there really wasn't a huge difference in the survey and the response. It's just like I think it was 50 I can't remember how many people they got the response was. But I just thought, wow, no matter the political leaning, this wide acceptance that I can cause harm to you because I disagree with you.

Uh I no wonder people are going to like that's a problem, right? And because there's a there's a failure to see the other as other. That's why I'm saying the the categorization has to stop. You're a fascist. You're a Nazi. You're a communist. We How can we label people like that? And even if you do, just those three examples that I just said are all responsible for murdering people. What and that's I think what ends up happening when you uh subscribe to or ascribe to yourself an absolute ideological position on something. Everyone else who not only does not share that, but who opposes it is now a threat. They're not just an opponent, they're a threat. And so you have to be eliminated. And and we've seen this across the board throughout history, perhaps most intensely in the 20th century. And so I I I think if we don't more humbly acknowledge that my opponents are not enemies, but are people for me to engage with, ask questions of. We are going to continue to see more and more of this kind of behavior, especially when it's coupled with data like that. 34% of students thinking that's acceptable to do harm or violence to someone you disagree with. How how can we there's there's many societal factors that I think that would contribute to that at the current time but a lot of it has to do with the failure to see the other as another as as another as an extension of me. I wonder u if part of the contributing um to the problem is also the the digital media that we consume because when we watch something on our phones, it's just a thing. It's a thing. That thing is a story and we fail to see it's a person. Mhm. So now when we're on real life and we see somebody that we disagree with, that's just another thing. It's just another story. It's not a person because we just scroll through tragedy, real life tragedy with real people like it's it's entertainment. It satisfies a morbid curiosity instead of seeing a person. I I just wonder if this is what I haven't seen the actual footage of him being murdered. Charlie Kirk, I I know you did. I would not I don't want to see that. I don't want that in my mind. But the effect of that if you see it often enough in in different places. Well, let's just just another thing. What's the difference between that and a movie? Now we we might know, okay, that really happened. But I wonder if that's part of also the po problem where where then you got people who rejoice in this rejoice in his murder. Mhm. That's something that I has just found so terribly disturbing. Yes. And I I don't I some find myself wonder I don't know how even to respond to that that you could rejoice in that even if you so disagree with his views fine. I'm sure I could go through his views and find things I could disagree with. I'm sure anyone could cuz I I I disagree with myself sometimes. But the fact that you would want to or you delight that this person no longer exists, I find ter terribly troubling. It it it truly is. And and I think you're you have it right on when you say it's born out of the fact that we we don't see people as people. Partly because of how easily we can just scroll past individuals because they're just another picture on our screen. And I I think the failure to have authentic and healthy human interaction is probably a large part of why this this division seems like it's growing further because all we're really doing is giving oursel more and more reason to believe that I can't be with you because you're one of them. and we don't get along. So, you stay on your side and I'll stay on my side instead of trying to come into contact with each other. I I really I think that if we can't start having more frequent contact with the people that we disagree with and don't like and think are out to lunch on any given topic, we are at least to some extent only also ourselves contributing to the problem. Um I know that you mentioned that you saw part of the memorial. Um, I didn't didn't ask when or how, but you mentioned that you saw Tucker Tucker Carlson make some comments. Uh, just your observation what he saw cuz he you did just before we turned on the cameras did say Yeah, I I did. I heard I came in the middle of someone else. I had to leave just after Tucker Carlson finished. So his portion I happened to see live and uh I was really grateful for the way in which he was able to speak about obviously how important Charlie's faith was to him. Uh but I what I really took out of what he had to say was he he hit the nail on the head with what we've just been talking about. He said the problem with the world is me. And as he began, I was waiting for him to go on to exactly what I would have expected. Uh these activists and the political left and we have to deal with the Marxists and I when he said I'm the problem because the only solution to the problem is personal conversion. I have to change.

And that summarizes it as succinctly as you can put it that if I change, if I am converted, if I can surrender myself to the grace and power of Jesus Christ and let him transform me into who I ought to be, who I know I am not at this moment, then I might have a positive contribution to make to others wanting to do the same for themselves. elves. That's why it really fascinates me to wonder what in these last few weeks was happening in the mind and the heart of Charlie Kirk. Is it true that he was on the brink of saying to himself, "I need to be different. Something needs to change and and it has to start with me." He and Tucker apparently enjoyed a pretty close relationship. So the fact that that would be the way in which he thought to reflect upon Charlie's life and memorialize him, I thought that was perhaps one of the greatest things that could be said about someone that that person had the willingness and the capacity to change. Closing thoughts. uh only just that I hope and pray from out of this people will begin looking for meaning and not just by going even further inward and down deeper rabbit holes by themselves online but that they start looking for each other. I was sharing with you earlier this past weekend at my church. People were just coming in off the street who some talked to me, some didn't. I don't know who a bunch of people were between all of my different masses, but they all had a similar facial expression and it was of looking for something. And I hope they know that they're looking for someone and that they're not going to find that person by themsel.

Thank you. Thank you.